Hey void man do you know anything about RHCE?

Place to discuss Fedora and/or Red Hat
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Hey void man do you know anything about RHCE?

Post by bazoukas » Wed Jan 29, 2003 7:56 pm

Seems like I am going way too fast for School. They just drag their ass all over the place and am serisouly thinking of preparing my self for the RHCE.

Does it count for something in the Market? I know it wont hurt, but do people out there actually know what it is?

I am not planning in taking their expensive courses. Just to do it on my own.

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Post by Void Main » Wed Jan 29, 2003 8:22 pm

I believe it to be one of the most respected admin type certs out there (above Solaris, MCSE, etc). I personally don't have one because I don't believe in certs (the only one I have is from Cisco).

Having said that, I do believe in many cases having a cert may be the difference in you getting an interview. Once at the interview stage all bets are off and certs/degrees are out the window. Then it comes down to what you really know.

Now, the job competition right now is fierce so every piece of paper you can get your hands on can't hurt your chances for getting an interview. It's amazing how the market has changed within the last two years.

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Post by bazoukas » Wed Jan 29, 2003 8:44 pm

Thank you VoidMan.

Am already ordering few books,Begginers Socket programming for Linux, and am looking what else looks helpfull. I am not going to buy any of those RHCE books. Long live the man pages and ze internet.

Even though I will continue with my studies to get a computer science degree, I want to give a try with this.




Void, you cannot belive how much of a Linux zealot (not in a scary way though) I have become.

If I can have it my way, I would rather work for a smaller company that uses Open source and not for a big company that is hooked with MS, even if the money is less.

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Post by Void Main » Wed Jan 29, 2003 9:28 pm

There are a lot of big companies that have a lot of Microsoft (and Microsoft nazies). But they also usually have a lot of proprietary UNIX (Solaris, AIX, HP-UX, etc). You have to know how to play well with them and not be too much of an ass (I know, it's hard, but it's possible). I have found that Linux is like a common ground between the Microsoft and UNIX side of the house. In my experience there is a lot of interest in it on both sides of the house.

I worked for a large (and well known) corporation. I introduced Linux to the company about 6 years ago when I was first hired. I used Linux as my primary desktop (the only one in the company). I soon after was asked to be part of the "Advanced Technologies" department. My new boss was a Microsoft Nazi. He made a comment to someone else who relayed it to me that I was to get rid of Linux. I told that third party that I would quit before I would use a Microsoft operating system on my workstation. The third party relayed that information back to my boss and I never heard another word until about a month or two later when he was fired. :)

I left that company about a year back (The company was bought out by another company who's headquarters is in another city. I wasn't willing to move). By the time I left there I had around 100 Linux servers doing tasks for free that normally would have been done by either a proprietary UNIX servers or a proprietary Windows servers, both of which would have required expensive additional software. In all cases I would not have put Linux in those roles without it being able to do the job better than it's proprietary counterpart. Now we still had 200-300 proprietary servers (Solaris, HP-UX, WinNT) and 2,000 Microsoft desktops but we were on the verge of rolling out large specialized applications on Linux desktops.

By the time I left I was the senior engineer for all of the UNIX systems and half of the NT systems corporate wide (over several locations/cities). And I also held the position of manager of the UNIX systems group for the entire company (I always tried to stay away from having "manager" in my title. Turned down a couple of director level offers). Prior to working at that company I spent 5 years as a programmer and senior UNIX systems guy (Mainframe, AIX RS/6000 clusters, and Linux) in the Air Force.

Now I just wish I had a job! :( Hurry up and get your degree, then get a job, then hire me! :) The last one I interviewed for had 250 applicants, just from one newspaper ad. Like I said, the competition is fierce right now (at least in this city). Get your degree, and get that RHCE cert while you are getting your degree.
Last edited by Void Main on Wed Jan 29, 2003 10:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by bazoukas » Wed Jan 29, 2003 10:13 pm

I bought these
Free for all . From Peter Wayne
Linux Network Servers 24 seven by craig Hunt
Rebel Code by Glyd Moody
Linux socket programing example by example by Warren Gay


49 dollars all together from Amazon.




Ouch man.
I didnt know it was that hard. :shock:
Right now am on an accelerated Associates program (good luck with it, i know). Too bad my first two years in USA i didnt major in CS and I was in psychology. Bah. :roll:

And you got fired for not using M$? Hell yeah man. You kick ass. I my self in school I avoid M$ like the devil. Long live knopix. And when I have no choice but to use the MS compiler for VB and it shits on it self, you can hear a deep loud voice with an accent going "For fscks sake with Microsoft". Am 27 years old 6.2 6.3 and 225-230 pounds. So the instructors dont say much to me.


And I can only Imagine how competetive its going to be for me, since you already have a HUGE wealth of knowledge and experience and its still hard for you. But hell its ok. One day at a time.


oops man. In two years I will be done with EVERYTHING school wise. If I see am smart enough for this and you can varify it lol, we should hook up and start our own company. :shock: :D Hell even create a Linux distro. Who knows man. Everything starts with just a small idea like Linux did.


One thing I know for sure, I am taking Open Source very seriously. As one guy had in his at MES "Linux is a state of mind". Its not that you use an OS that is better, its the principle that a person chooses to stand behind and support it.


Anyway. Am on a stupid rant here. Dont mind me, I am a bit of a retard


:lol:

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Post by Void Main » Wed Jan 29, 2003 10:28 pm

bazoukas wrote:I bought these
Free for all . From Peter Wayne
Linux Network Servers 24 seven by craig Hunt
Rebel Code by Glyd Moody
Linux socket programing example by example by Warren Gay
Sound like good reads. I have shelves upon shelves full of books, most of which have only been thumbed through once or twice. Only a couple of them have the pages worn off. I have better luck with the Internet. I have become an expert googler. :)
And you got fired for not using M$?
No, I didn't get fired. My boss got fired. They knew which one of us to get rid of. :) I don't remember ever being close to being fired. Can't imagine it. How could anyone not luv me?
Am 27 years old 6.2 6.3 and 225-230 pounds. So the instructors dont say much to me.
I'm quite a bit older than you, quite a bit shorter than you, and just recently became quite a bit lighter than you. :) I was up to about 210 last year. I dropped about 20 pounds in the last two months and believe I would be at the perfect weight if I could drop about 15 or 20 more. I should be able to do better X-Game stunts on my dirt bike after dropping the weight. :)
And I can only Imagine how competetive its going to be for me, since you already have a HUGE wealth of knowledge and experience and its still hard for you. But hell its ok. One day at a time.
Yeah, I'm hoping things pick up real quick. I believe they will but I was hoping for that to happen about 6 months ago..
spit man. In two years I will be done with EVERYTHING school wise. If I see am smart enough for this and you can varify it lol, we should hook up and start our own company. :shock: :D Hell even create a Linux distro. Who knows man. Everything starts with just a small idea like Linux did.
I actually had my own company (well, me and a couple of partners). We just gave it up this past month. We had it for the last couple of years but it was more of a pain in the rear than anything (we all had different ideas of what we wanted to do). I do still do freelance work (Linux installs, server/router install/configuration, some programming, etc).
One thing I know for sure, I am taking Open Source very seriously. As one guy had in his at MES "Linux is a state of mind". Its not that you use an OS that is better, its the principle that a person chooses to stand behind and support it.
Good for you. It's a good fight that is well worth it. I'll never stop.

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Post by bazoukas » Wed Jan 29, 2003 10:45 pm

HA..and i thought i was the only that had some books that are not opened.
But for real, is some respects I have a short attention span. Thats why I prefer books. Damn internet is full of colors and I wonder off all over the place :oops:


Here are two of my major ideas void.
Open up a school that teaches Unix Linux all the way. From QT programming, to C++ for Linux GNU, Unix-Linux Networking and so on. Pure Open source enviroment. This is from what I understand kinda daring but hey, it sounds like fun.

My other Idea is (and I know that am not the only one who thought of it and Red Hat and SUSE are heading that way) a Linux distro that is even more flexible than RH and SUSE. By this I mean that the user can choose from a really dumbed down way of functionality (pretty much EVERYTHING is automated) to going all crazy and have EVERYTHING done manualy. In other words no need for a housewife or for a blue collar jo to worry about configuring things the hard way. Maybe this is a stupid idea since am a noob. Time will tell while am learning more and my ideas will get more complex.

BTW from what I remember from a post at MES, you had an ISP company?

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Post by Void Main » Wed Jan 29, 2003 11:10 pm

bazoukas wrote:HA..and i thought i was the only that had some books that are not opened. But for real, is some respects I have a short attention span. Thats why I prefer books. Damn internet is full of colors and I wonder off all over the place.
That's why I reduce the colors by filtering out all the advertisements and popups with Squid and adzapper. Helps keep me focused on the things that matter.
Here are two of my major ideas void.
Open up a school that teaches Unix Linux all the way. From QT programming, to C++ for Linux GNU, Unix-Linux Networking and so on. Pure Open source enviroment. This is from what I understand kinda daring but hey, it sounds like fun.
I have people coming to me all the time with ideas, most of which never get started, some I actually have developed to near completion and then we got cold feet and never followed through all the way for fear of a flop, etc... I have thought about something like a Linux technical school or some sort of training program. This is the first one I've gotten specific to programming. That sounds like a great addition. I actually left the Air Force because they wanted to move me to Mississippi to be an instructor at the Air Force's computer programming school.

I am much less into hard core programming in recent years and am more into administration/configuration and I do a lot of Perl/PHP/Script programming. Every once in a while I'll do a little C. But you could take the programming side of the house, and I'll take the administration/configuration side (and the networking side of course). :) Red Hat already has a great course though so we would have to compete with them. I like their way of doing things with more hands on. I would like to create a certification that an employer would be sure they are not hiring a dumb ass. I suppose we would have to be much cheaper as well.

Now, in order for us to do something like the above we would need the talent, the business plan, have it all thought out thoroughly, the capital (in my case it would require a loan or investor), and most importantly the need (customer). I've always been scared to venture into something big like this for risk of failure. But in order to be successful you have to be willing to take the risk.
My other Idea is (and I know that am not the only one who thought of it and Red Hat and SUSE are heading that way) a Linux distro that is even more flexible than RH and SUSE. By this I mean that the user can choose from a really dumbed down way of functionality (pretty much EVERYTHING is automated) to going all crazy and have EVERYTHING done manualy. In other words no need for a housewife or for a blue collar jo to worry about configuring things the hard way. Maybe this is a stupid idea since am a noob. Time will tell while am learning more and my ideas will get more complex.
Don't be discouraged if I criticize something, it just means it would need more justification. My opinion on this is there are a hundred distros out there trying to get to the exact specification you mention. Tough competition.
BTW from what I remember from a post at MES, you had an ISP company?
I never had an ISP but I have a friend who does and we had some servers there that we did hosting work for small businesses (part of the business we just sold/gave up last month). Actually it's not really an ISP, it is a hosting facility where he provides the space and network for people to host servers in, and he has his own servers that he also does hosting on.

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Post by Calum » Thu Jan 30, 2003 3:27 am

bazoukas, i am in a similar boat to you! i think i have less knowledge and experience though. i start a 'Computing and Information Technology' degree next month, but i think it will be a bit windocentric.
I'd buy books, but i always feel like there's a bit of a gap between what i already know and what they tell me. I printed out a big tutorial about ipchains and iptables for instance and it's just a little beyond me (i know :roll: ) so i read and reread it not getting much out of it.

I've been using linux for a while now and i think if i want to learn i'll have to step up a gear somehow, as i am learning but at a fairly slow pace.

One thing i want to know is, if you learn everything that would be in an RHCE course, but you don't actually do the course, does that really help you? (excepting the fact that you know everything about red hat?) I know that a lot of people (sadly) value the bit of paper over the actual skills it represents...

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Post by bazoukas » Thu Jan 30, 2003 8:20 pm

My guess Calum is that it would really help to have that paper.
From what I understand there is a huge fixation in papers out in the market.

Unless, you show them proof that you really know by showing them projects you have done on your own. Like building a basic Linux distro, or showcasing your own server.

Void though would know better about that.

Obviously you are a very smart person and people can see that but some are so fixated on "papers" they end up not caring if you actually know what you really know.
One of the network instructors has told me many horror stories with people that
graduated from high end schools and they didnt know jack oops.
Are you on an Associates program calum?
Right now i am routing my self from Computer Apps programming Associates degree to Computer Science.

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Post by Calum » Fri Jan 31, 2003 7:03 am

i'm studying part time from home via an open learning program.

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Post by X11 » Fri Jan 31, 2003 9:35 pm

Yea at school im going to make the admin put Linux on my system because where doing databases and stuff in my VCE IT class. And some webpage design, which all i could do faster with a Linux system. Well looks like i'll be doing lots at home or buying a laptop.

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Post by Linux Frank » Sat Feb 01, 2003 10:39 am

bazoukas wrote: ... From what I understand there is a huge fixation in papers out in the market.
This is true I am sad to say. Working in the engineering environment is much more flexible, but there is still this belief that paper is all. And it only gets worse with the big companies.

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Post by Tux » Sun Feb 02, 2003 5:27 pm

I'm gonna be starting a 'Computer Studies' A-Level next year, it incorporates beginning OOP and basic system/network admin stuff. It is gonna be fscking boring and I am going to have to spend 2 years infront of some windoid teacher who will know less than me...
Anyway, it will be another qualification and will show that I have had direction from an early(ish) age.
After that i'm off to Uni to do a computer course of some sort. I had an interview with the Careers Advisor a week or two ago, he didnt give me any advice for careers. He did though say he was putting me on his 'Oxbridge List'. So it looks like this geek is off to Cambridge University :D in a few years.

When I leave Uni I dunno what I wanna do, I might stay to do some research, that would be great. But, I'll most likely be tempted by the evils of £££ and go get a job. I'm not sure what i'd like to do, I know I wouldn't like to program, I can see from my dad that that becomes a drag after a while. Maybe admin type stuff although I don't know how well that pays. Idealy I'd like to work for (and one day own) a consultancy, that would give me a variety of tasks and I would enjoy working out and implementing solutions. Who knows, i'm only 16...

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Post by X11 » Mon Feb 03, 2003 12:50 am

Many teachers may not know as much as you, but they understand many things and are more experienced, even windoids. Anyways my brothers IT teacher HATES Microsoft. Anyways I feel that its better to teach yourself things. Mainly programming, as then you go at your own level.

Void Main its a bit to ask but could you do some kind of biography, explaining how/where you learned things, ect.

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