Will Debian (Ubuntu) achieve mainstream market for linux

Place to discuss Debian Linux and Debian based distributions
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Post by JoeDude » Wed Aug 16, 2006 3:52 am

Check the topic...


Is everybody happy now?

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Void Main
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Post by Void Main » Wed Aug 16, 2006 7:30 am

Heh heh, you didn't have to change the topic title but I still wouldn't consider it "the" pioneer. Debian by itself could possibly be considered "a" pioneer but I would consider SLS to fit the "pioneer" description before Debian and long, long, long before Ubunutu.

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Post by JoeDude » Wed Aug 16, 2006 7:40 am

lol...geez, there's no pleasing this crowd!

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Post by Void Main » Wed Aug 16, 2006 7:46 am

Well, when you've been around Linux since the beginning you have to keep things straight. That's still not an easy task:
http://lwn.net/Articles/91371/

I recall another distro in a time long ago that forked off of Red Hat in a very similar way that Ubuntu has forked off of Debian. There are so many things about it's story that parallel the Current Ubunut story. From it's users' enthusiasm to how it's backed and built. Anyone remember Mandrake? Hopefully things turn out better for Ubuntu. No matter what happens to it (good or bad) there will always be Debian. There are several reasons for it but mostly because of the motivations that drive Debian are different than the motivations that drive Ubuntu (and Mandrake before it).

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Post by ZiaTioN » Wed Aug 16, 2006 9:11 am

hmmm...

I had no idea that Mandrake was a RH spin off...

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Post by Void Main » Wed Aug 16, 2006 9:22 am

Yep, there are/were several forks of Red Hat. The first version of Mandrake was basically just Red Hat with KDE set as the default desktop environment. How many parallels to Ubuntu can you find?

http://wiki.linuxquestions.org/wiki/Mandrake

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Post by Ice9 » Wed Aug 16, 2006 11:13 am

And then you have PCLinuxOS that is a spin off of Mandrake ...

Parallels to ubuntu?
Mepis, Xandros, Linspire/Freespire, Progeny, and I'm sure there are lots more!

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Post by Ice9 » Wed Aug 16, 2006 11:43 pm

Some stats to compare package versions in both ubuntu and Debian and correct some misconceptions about version numbers.

I do not agree entirely with the author's view though when he says
Yes, Scott, I am comparing stable releases on one side, with development versions on the other side. However, I think that it is widely known that Debian testing is usable outside of the Debian development community. I know many people using Debian testing who aren’t Debian developers. And many Ubuntu users, if they weren’t using Ubuntu, but Debian, would probably use Debian testing, not stable.
If I'm correct every new release of ubuntu is a snapshot of Debian "stable" for the core of the system merged with the latest packages from "unstable" for the applications.
That makes it similar to Debian "unstable" in my book - which, by the way, is not unstable at all and continually up-to-date thanks to a daily apt-get dist-upgrade routine!

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Post by Jenda » Thu Aug 17, 2006 5:38 am

WHOA!
Since when does sudo give you root access without asking for a password?

http://img101.imageshack.us/my.php?imag ... hotax8.png

Hope you like my desktop :-D

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Post by ZiaTioN » Thu Aug 17, 2006 7:49 am

I don't get it. It looks like there is a password prompt there to me...

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Post by Void Main » Thu Aug 17, 2006 8:14 am

Although it's not that way now, I thought the earlier versions had the sudoers file set to not require a password for sudo root commands for the first user created. This guy seemed to have the issue, although there is no telling if he may have followed someone elses directions on how to set up sudoers to not require a password prior to that:

http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=20724

When I install Ubuntu the first thing I do is set the root password and get rid of the sudoers file (I prefer not using sudo and opt for the traditional user/root setup) so my memory isn't real fresh on that. Nothing wrong with using sudo though as long as it is configured to require at least the user's password. Of course there are other special cases when you might want to set sudo up to be able to run certain specific commands without requiring a password, only in special cases though, not a normal desktop system.

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Post by ZiaTioN » Thu Aug 17, 2006 8:45 am

Well a certain case would be in automation. If you wrote a script to run as a non-privilaged user but wanted to execute a specific binary with root privilages you would not want sudo to prompt for a password if you script was not "expect" in nature.

But there are others ways of doing this in each language which may be better than running a strait system() call using sudo.

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Post by Void Main » Thu Aug 17, 2006 8:52 am

Yes, that is a good example. I have also used sudo in backend web scripts to run a specific command under a user other than "apache" or "httpd" (such as root). For instance, I have created a network block command that manipulates iptables rules which of course need root authority. When a certain URL is attempted on my web server the IP automatically gets blocked via this command. I have set up sudoers to allow the web server user to run this specific command and block bad addresses. I have also used it to manipulate the squid configuration from an administrative web interface. There are several other similar cases.

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Post by JoeDude » Thu Aug 17, 2006 11:00 am

I do believe you'll find that script is all ready there in ubuntu.

As far as routine lines, ie.. running MPlayer you type gmplayer and it just works

However,

If you type sudo apt-get updates you are then asked for the password. It's also smart, it doesn't ask for the password again if sudo apt-get upgrades and sudo apt-get install upgrades is used immediately following the updates.

Edit:

OK playing with it a little more..it seems once you use the SUDO command and use the password, that's all that's required. Maybe there's a timer on it. I even exited the terminal and brought it back up and it allowed me to sudo without a password...I don't know what the exact circumstances are, maybe it's just the first sudo that requires a password?

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